Let's face it.
Without your team members, you'd likely be drowning in client work right now.
But, fortunately, you have great people working with you that believe in you and your company and are providing terrific results.
Sometimes, though, things can get busy and, as a business owner, you might forget to let your staff know how grateful you are for their efforts.
It's important to acknowledge their excellence and help them grow in their roles.
Our guest, Tammy Christiansen of Aeble Business Services realizes this and has seen her business prosper as a result of taking care of her staff.
It truly does make a difference.
During this interview, you'll discover...
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Why you should allow your staff to make some decisions to improve the business while you have the final say
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Why you must encourage and support your team through good and bad times
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Why you should consider investing in your staff by having them take courses & other educational opportunities
To learn more about Tammy, visit this link.
To find her on The Successful Bookkeeper Facebook Group, you can join here.
EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION
Michael Palmer: 01:10 Welcome back to The Successful Bookkeeper podcast. I am your host, Michael Palmer, and today's show is going to be another great one. Our guest is the owner of Abel Business Services Inc, which is based in Georgetown, Ontario. She is an IPBC member of the Institute of Professional Bookkeepers of Canada and she is also a Pure Bookkeeping licensee who is experiencing some terrific success and is here to share and detail how she hires staff and manages that staff and how it's played a part in the growth of her business. Tammy Christiansen, welcome to the podcast.
Tammy Christiansen: 01:48 Thank you. Thank you very much. It's lovely to be here.
MP: 01:51 Yes, and so great for you to give us your time today. So Tammy, before we get into how you manage and work with staff, tell us a little bit about yourself and share your career background.
TC: 02:06 So it's kind of an interesting path I took to get here. I started in HR with a call center. From there I moved to, I'm assisting two separate businesses who were personal financial advisors. From there I went into health and benefits and sales and marketing for a large multinational company and then I had my daughter and she had allergies and through wasn't a daycare who could figure out how to feed her. So then it was like, oh, okay, maybe I need to rethink how I'm working because right now my family needs me and I don't want to be commuting three hours a day. So we made the decisions when I'd worked for myself and I fell into bookkeeping. Really, I was looking somewhere where I could help other business owners grow and manage their businesses and here I am today.
MP: 03:08 Wow. Wow, excellent. Well, tell us a little bit about what your business is. It looks like today.
TC: 03:14 So we're kind of unique from most bookkeeping businesses because it's not just my side of the business. My husband has become a partner with me and so he does sales and purchasing for a couple of large national distributors of pop culture items, and so we've got that one side and then I kind of morphed what I was doing, Tao Pim and built a bookkeeping side of business as well as some general administration. Now it started out, it was just me. It's basically a virtual assistant working from home who was helping out some accountants as well. And then I realized, you know what, this bookkeeping thing, there's a lot of people really need help and they need good quality help. People who actually care and aren't just going to plug numbers in and spit something out. People who will help them read those numbers and understand what that means for their business.
MP: 04:15 Wow. It's so refreshing to hear and absolutely accurate. And so you've been helping business owners and how many staff do you have now?
TC: 04:25 So we are up to five and a half. If you count or part-time students who come in to kind of help us tackle the filing that just, you know how it is filing. So the last thing you want to do when you're doing other things. So we have someone to come in and help us with that activity.
MP: 04:45 Oh beautiful. So that's a decent size business from the staff perspective. And how long did it take you to go from the bookkeeping business side of things? How did it tell long did it take you to grow to where you are today?
TC: 05:00 So last summer when I purchased my pure bookkeeping license, it was me and one other person who worked part-time hours from there, you know, we purchased the systems. I started going through by my, I really got into them and said, okay, it's time to hire another person. And the next person I hire, they're learning the pure bookkeeping systems and they're going to hold the rest of us accountable to follow those systems because that's the only thing they will know. So we hired Coleen last September, so I was at three at that point. And since then I've also hired Lori and Beth.
MP: 05:42 Wow. And so how have you, I mean it's really great to hear it exciting for you. How have you seen the transition from doing it on your own, building your business and then implementing pure bookkeeping? What changes have you noticed?
TC: 06:01 It's a lot more clear in what I expect the other people to own and what I have to do. Before the Pure Bookkeeping system, I was having issues with my other bookkeeper to know, okay, this is the maintenance for that you have to do. And this is what you have to have accomplished before you hand the file over to me. I was often going in and saying, Hey, Jeez, why isn't that done? So then I tried to write the process so that she'd know what she had to do because I wasn't communicating it effectively to her because I didn't have time to stop and explain it to her.
MP: 06:39 Hmm. And now what does it look like using the pure Bookkeeping System?
TC: 06:45 Everybody knows you have to reconcile this account. So the basic bank accounts, but also have you reconciled the undeposited funds? Does the error match reality? All of these steps are there and laid out for the other staff to follow. And I mean the work we do is more than just bookkeeping because our job is to make our clients' lives easier, so we're constantly pulling other tasks from them as well to try to simplify. One client was trying to do their own invoicing and it's a disaster because we could never tell if they were paid or not because they just go and say, Oh yeah, we think we brought that money and they mark it as received on whatever day they did that they thought that they had received that money. But we actually found out later that the place they thought they had received money from wasn't actually the place. And Oh, by the way, that company went bankrupt and you never went and put in your claim to get any money back. So you've just lost all that money.
MP: 07:54 Wow. Wow. Yeah, I mean that's a great example of proactively, I mean, if we could jump at a time machine and go back, I mean that's the value of what a great bookkeeper can do, is to keep an eye on the financial health of the business and keep all those checks and balances so that that doesn't happen.
TC: 08:14 And now our relationship has improved with them and we're, and we've taken on more from them and they're like, we don't even have to collect our money. Your girl. Just follows up as if we haven't been paid.
MP: 08:30 Beautiful. That's fantastic.
MP: 08:40 You know, with you, you mentioned something around your fear first staff that you hired that took on the pure bookkeeping. When you took on the pure bookkeeping system and you had them, how did that go when you were, you were having them hold you accountable. What was that like? I'm really curious.
TC: 08:56 Um, it was interesting for her because it's, it's a bit of a strange dynamic when you're first said business, having the boss tell you these are systems now and you have to make me follow them. And you know, she's, she's a very reserved girl and a lot of senses. But um, you know, she took on that leadership role and she reminded me a few times, um, you know, we're supposed to be doing it this way now. And I'd be like, yes, yes, you're right. Thank you. And then they go back on track and it's served us well. It's, it's funny when I hired her, I said, in 10 years I want to be at 10 bookkeepers. And so I think we'll probably add maybe one person a year or so. That's, that's how quickly we'll grow. And then the next thing you knew, I'd hired two more people because it demand is there and we have to space.
MP: 09:53 It's just, I'm an amazing and to think, you know, what, you know what you thought possible on one side and then now what's happening. I mean it's, you know, 10, 10, 10 years, 10 bookkeepers and now you're at, you know, how many are you at within a year? It's, it's remarkable. Really rewarding.
TC: 10:15 So we've had to change my 10-year goal.
MP: 10:18 You know, it's really, I think inspiring, right? It's a numb, no, there's, there's a couple of messages there, right? Number one, you had a goal, you had a vision and, and then you recreated and you have a new goal and you refresh those goals. And so often people, you know, have coached now thousands of people in the business. And often people will come up with these really, really grand, lofty goals and, and it, oh, it's sold. They're so lofty and so grand that they, they're almost impossible to achieve. And the person's mind. And so they don't take the actions where if you have a vision that's clear and you have a goal that is attainable and that you can jump towards, then you achieve that and then you, you know, it doesn't end. You create a new goal you can. And so getting, it's almost like climbing up that mountain. It's like, yeah, I want to get up, have a real lofty view and vision of where I want to go, but I need to be thinking in, well, we got to get to a base camp here, right? So we're going to get to the top of Everest, but let's focus on base camp right now. And so it sounds like you're, you're cruising on the past base camp just great.
TC: 11:33 Yeah. A friend of mine told me a quote years ago, it kind of stuck. If you've got castles in the air, you're working not be lost. That's where the castle should be. Now put the foundations under them.
MP: 11:46 Beautiful. I love it. I love it. Now, Tammy, often people ask what the pure bookkeeping system is and I really love because you are a licensee and we're going to get into sharing some of the tips on hiring. But before we do that from, you know, from your perspective, you had a business, you were writing systems for your business and process and documentation. Why did you look to pure bookkeeping as, as an investment to make in your business?
TC: 12:20 I looked at the cost of the time, so to the opportunity cost of me sitting there and writing the systems and processes, um, I can do it. I have that skill set. That's something I really enjoy. But while I was doing that, I wasn't out doing the work that made me money. So I could stop and write those processes and if it would have saved me a fee because to purchase the license. But I factored, you know, how much my time was earth versus how much time I thought it would actually take for me to write these things based on a few that I had written. And then when I heard that, you know, Debbie had been bookkeeping for so many years and she'd grown her business, she had already gone through a lot of the steps. So I was looking to go through why would I recreate the wheel? So yes, it, it was an investment and I had to sit down with, with my partner and my husband and say, okay, this is what I think we should do and this is why I think we should do it. And you know, it took us a few days but you know, we're here for the long term. I wanted to build a business where I could help other people and I wanted to be able to get out there and help other people faster and just purchasing the license did that for me.
MP: 13:44 Great. That's a really great perspective. And having looked at it from that perspective and now having used it and implemented, what's your view now? Where do you see the value in the system?
TC: 13:56 I see the value in that we're building consistency in what we're doing. So I should be able to hop into one of my girls files and know exactly where a transaction has been placed. If I'm looking for something specific, it's not, hmm, is that going to be shareholder advance or is it going to be this or is it going to be that we've made a conscious decision to follow these systems? There are a few cases where we've tweaked it a little so it fits us better. But for the most part, those are the systems we follow and we all follow them. So if somebody away for two weeks going to England perhaps and I need to jump into file or I need somebody else to jump in and cover them, it's really not that big of an issue. We have. We have and we have our systems that we're following.
MP: 14:54 Beautiful. Well, you've done it really in an interesting way and it sounds like it's working. What kind of results would you say you've produced since becoming a Pure Bookkeeping licensee? From the business side of things, so business results,
TC: 15:09 Um, we've really seen our numbers, um, improve dramatically. Okay. Every profit, our net profit margin, it's up.
MP: 15:23 Beautiful. That's exciting. Well, congratulations on that and thank you for sharing it. And you know, our mission is to help great bookkeepers grow their business, um, and, and in doing so to transform the bookkeeping industry. And so you're one of those and we do it in a number of ways, but you're one of those people that has done it at the highest level of what we'd like to see. And so thank you for sharing that and sharing with our listener both about systems and processes and as well your journey with pure bookkeeping. You've mentioned hiring staff and this is, you know, you've hired a few since, uh, just in the last year. In your opinion, what does a great bookkeeping employee, uh, look like?
TC: 16:07 Well, let me turn the question around for a second and let me talk about what supports you have do you have in place in order to enable someone to be a great bookkeeper?
MP: 16:20 Okay. I love it.
TC: 16:22 Our job is to offer the best in class service to our clients. And I'm depending on my staff to deliver that because I can't always be the one to do it. There's, there's too much going on. So I need them to do it as well as me. So for that to happen, I know that my staff needs to be empowered, so they have to have the ability to make decisions to improve things. However, I maintained a right to veto any decision. They have to be encouraged. We have to be there to support them and work together as a team. Being a bookkeeper can be extremely isolating. One of the reasons why I think they stay working for me instead of going out and I'm offering my clients a lower rate and taking them from me is because I'm there to work with them.
TC: 17:08 And as a team, you know, we encourage each other. We're challenged every day. Um, we're constantly learning new things, which I, I think really makes a day a little bit more fun. If it was the same thing every day, just data entry, you know, it, why would anybody do that over the long term? Um, I try to do my best to make sure that my staff feels appreciated and supported. Recently actually, one of my business mentors put me onto a book called the five languages of appreciation in the workplace by Gary Chapman and Paul White. So I've been looking at how my staff feels appreciated because different people feel appreciated in different ways. And it's interesting the results of the people that I've chosen to work in my business. For the most part, we all feel appreciated in the same way. So that's what I think we need to have in place in order to have good bookkeepers work for us.
MP: 18:21 What a, an inspiring place to work by the sounds of things. And you clearly have people that enjoy working for you. What have been some bumps along the way?
TC: 18:34 Some bumps along the way is me having enough time to do everything. I am the bottleneck. So I have to learn to delegate, I have to learn to train others to take on certain tasks. And um, I've been teaching them how to manage me because they'll ask me for something and you know, I may forget. So they have to know to remind me.
MP: 19:01 That's absolutely accurate. And you know, I think there's a, a, a message of leadership just in the way that you took on your first staff to implement, to pure bookkeeping system. It was a leadership role out of the gate and do, you had to give up something you had to give up being the boss, if you will, because having, telling somebody that they're going to hold the boss accountable is, is a, is really a different way of, of looking at things in a different way to approach it. And it creates an opportunity for what you created was a create an opportunity for leadership, which when people have a purpose and they have an ownership or yet have the autonomy, people thrive in those roles because they feel like they're making a difference. And so I think it's really excellent that you've set it up that way. And that's the culture that you've built. Anything to say around what have you had feedback from your staff as to what it's like working in your environment?
TC: 20:08 Uh, it can be loud at times. Um, we're, we're in a pretty small space. Um, and you know, it's, it's interesting. I have had different feedback from them. They've been quite good about telling me when they think something's not working. Something that was important for one of the girls was Donald filing stick. It was something I had never even thought of having here. It just didn't occur to me. And you know, that $15 investment has really saved us a lot of time when we're filing. So it's little things. Um, we try to have a weekly meeting where we sit down and talk as a group. Okay, what's happening with each of the clients? Where things that, is there something that we need to improve? So what's working, what isn't, how are things going? What do you need from the rest of us to make your life better?
MP: 21:08 Beautiful. Now you filing stick. I don't know what that is.
TC: 21:13 Um, so it's a stick with the alphabet and then a few numbers at the end. Uh, it also has months on it and a few other things. And basically, if you have a big pile of filing, you can sort it alphabetically and then just grab the A's and file the A's and grabbed the PS and filed to be so that you can quickly just filling it in and then sort it from there. So when we had six very unorganized boxes, um, come over with a cleanup client, we were able to fairly quickly make it through and get things organized to the point where we could actually locate things as we were looking for them.
MP: 21:57 Beautiful. So this is like a, this long thing with a whole bunch of flops on it. Is that, is that the idea? I thought it was a stick that you just hit the files and they filed themselves.
TC: 22:09 I think we would all love that magic spot.
MP: 22:11 I would be a, yeah, we'd make a lot of money selling that. Unbelievable. So what about the personalities of your staff? You know, human beings, right? I always like to say that if you have human beings, you're going to have problems because we're all human beings, right? So we're part of the problem. But part of that is the personalities of, of people and, and sometimes they clash. How would have you found?
TC: 22:39 Um, so I've been really, really careful when hiring. There are a few things so that I'm clear about before somebody comes in to do the testing and if they don't follow the direction in that they're automatically at the door. There was one woman didn't even finish the test and I said, thank you for your time, but you're not the right fit for the organization. You can, you can pull. Now she's a little bit annoyed, but um, there are two people in our office with asthma, so we're no scent. And I was clear about the fact that she couldn't wear any strongly scented colognes or perfumes. Um, and that if she came in smelling strongly of cigarette smoke, there would be someone here who would have health issues from it. Um, actually I'm allergic to cigarette smoke too. I wasn't even thinking of myself at that point. So she came in and one of my girls had to go upstairs. Thankfully the other person with asthma wasn't in the office and she was having an asthma attack upstairs because of this person into our space spelling so strongly of a clone. And you know, that's the type of thing where if somebody were to do that every single day, it would make life miserable for us.
TC: 23:58 Yeah. But you know, our, our personality is actually mixed really well even though we're all so very different. We have some base values that we follow that are in what package I go through with you before you even start. Um, you were told that as an organization we respect the inherent dignity and worth of every individual.
MP: 24:23 It's wonderful. I think there's a, you know, to point out for, for someone who doesn't follow instructions and the detail, I mean, you are, it is a technical role and part of the characteristic of a great bookkeeper to have attention to detail. And so even that little question says a lot about someone who does not read the fine print. I mean, I'm not a person that, you know, I often miss the details, right? My, this the way that I am, I'm not a bookkeeper and so I wouldn't make a great one because I don't believe that my attention to detail is at the level that's necessary. It's like really capturing it all.
MP: 25:04 And so if you make a mistake where you put a decimal point that can really affect somebody's paycheck,
MP: 25:11 It is multiple moles. Even the example that you used of, you know, knowing where that money came from and oh it didn't come from that person, it came from this other person and that person's now in business. I mean those are, those are details that now you know, you need to, you want on your team. Right? And so part of the value proposition that you, you're providing to your clients is that we're going to take care of those details. We're going to be the ones that are watching for the, the eyes not being dotted and the t's not crossed and made sure that it gets done correctly. And so your as a, as a bookkeeping owner, your job is to find great people like that with those skills and with those abilities to bring that to the business owner. Because if the business owner was great at it themselves or they had team members that were, then they just do it themselves, right?
MP: 26:02 Uh, inside of their organization. And that part is that, that's the whole thing we're in. That's the wrong thing to do. We want business owners focusing on what their strengths are and having that attention to detail is not that common. And so you've got to mix attention to detail with the skill set and acumen of be, of business and of bookkeeping and, and, and there's a lot to that. So you're mixing this cocktail of the perfect bookkeeper, then add human personalities and all of these things to it. It's, it's, it's challenging and that's, you know, it's not easy to do those people are out there, but if you don't find the right ones, what you'll have is chaos. And you're a great example of where you're building a team that fits your culture, fits your, your business. And, and such a great example of just one simple thing to pay attention to is, hey, don't come into the office with sense or smoke because we have, you know, if someone didn't pay attention to that, I mean it's an automatic fail and many cases. Right? Really cool.
TC: 27:09 One of the biggest things we look for in people is that they actually care. They have to care about the businesses we're working for. Because that right there makes a huge difference. Like if you see in the dental office that you're paying the associate a hundred percent of labs and then all of a sudden you're getting bills coming in that you're expected to pay, that looks like it's those very same labs that they're supposed to be covering. That's something that could very easily be missed. But our bookkeepers care, so they're watching, they're going, hey, that's not right. That's not fair to this business owner.
MP: 27:48 Mm. So great and caring is a strategic and definitely a competitive advantage and so wonderful that you're, you're focused on that. That's what business owners need and want people that care about their business and helping them be successful. And, and terms of your staff, how have they played a part in your company's success?
TC: 28:10 Oh, huge part. You know, I, I have people who are there and you know, it feels like I couldn't get them to work at any other office even if they paid some more because they love it here and that's, that's what I want. And if they're not feeling that way, I need to know it right away. I have people working for me who are willing to learn, who care about what they're doing every day to the point where they'll say, hey, that person not supposed to be paid a commission on this. Why are we trying to claim that? You know, it, they're just, we'd look out for the people that we work with.
MP: 28:53 Wonderful. You become a team.
MP: 29:01 It's not surprising your business is growing. How have you, you know, we're sort of moving away a little bit from the staff and the employees. If there, if there's anything else you'd like to add to the hiring process and how you manage staff, I'd love for you to chime in on that. But I have a question around your growth and acquiring new clients as well. So in terms of your growth and acquisition of new clients, where do you say the majority of it comes from?
TC: 29:30 Referral.
MP: 29:31 And why is that?
TC: 29:32 Send referral by an accountant. Um, because they've seen the work we do and how we care for our clients or from our clients as well. Um, I met a new client and within a week she said, okay, I've got like three different people I need you to work for. And I said, hold on, we've got a waiting list. Um, and your major cleanup, we need to get you sorted out first before we bring anybody new on. And it's just as a business owner, it can be really isolating and nobody really cares about your business if you're starting up a new shop and things are taking months longer and people aren't showing up when they're supposed to be, you are paying an extra month of French, your beer, paying for staff who should have started. But you're waiting for an inspector to tell you, you can turn on the ovens. People have to actually care about that. And as a business owner, nobody cares about your business, just you for the most part. Sometimes some of your better employees will. But mostly it's just you and with us, we, we care about their business. If we can, we act as a sleeper for people to their business. Even though right now we can't really take more referrals.
MP: 30:51 Wow. So really exciting. And, and um, you can see that your, the way you treat your clients, I mean it's just, um, it's, it's wonderful and it's no, not surprising. You get a lot of referrals. When you, you mentioned that your, your growth and the result of the pure bookkeeping system improved your net profit. Where's that gain really come from? Is it on the staffing side or is it been from some of the marketing you've done or changing of pricing? What, what was that, the result of?
TC: 31:25 Um, so it's a mix of things. It's staff definitely making a huge help with that. Following the pure bookkeeping system, we've been able to increase their rates. These become IPBC numbers. So that alone, it gives us more trustworthiness. So we have been gradually increasing our rates and also investing in my staff's future. We've had a few of us take different courses. One is pursuing a bookkeeping program at school and you know, I have to be able to invest in that kind of thing. So we're starting to charge a lot more than when it was just me working at as a bedroom in my home.
MP: 32:07 Fantastic. Really great to see and I'm excited to watch your future unfold. It's, it's, it's excellent. Are there any other tips or suggestions you'd like to share to help our listener?
TC: 32:21 If you're just getting started out and you're doing the bookkeeping for someone, ask yourself what's the next step? Don't feel like if you make this grand plan, it's going to overwhelm you. You don't need to look at 30 different steps at once. Just figure out what the next step forward is and makes up a step. Once you do that step, you move onto the next thing. Right now, my technology's holding me back, so I said, okay, what's the next step? Where do I go to fix this? And another pure bookkeeping licensee was kind enough to point me in the right direction of a quality person who can help me and you know what, we're on that path so my growths won't be held back by our technology any longer.
MP: 33:06 Beautiful. So much great advice and I mean for everyone to just think of things in terms of what's the next step. We know where we need to get to or want to get to. What is the next step to get there? Beautiful. Tammy, this has been great. Where can people find out more about you?
TC: 33:26 Hmm, that's a good question. I've been really, really lax with marketing. We do have a website but there's not a lot on there. We have a Facebook page but we're not active with it cause for two pissy anyway.
MP: 33:40 So likely you're, you're in the, on Facebook and you're in the Facebook groups. Perhaps we can put a link to your group and you know the name will be there. So just go and search the group. If, if your listener wants to connect with Tammy and have any questions, do it that way and those links will be in the show notes.
TC: 34:01 Yup. And just remember before you can succeed, first, you have to try.
MP: 34:06 Beautiful words to live by and a great way to end off our interview. And Tammy, thank you so much for your time and for, for sharing everything about your business and where you're headed and things that are working for you. And it's been great.
TC: 34:25 Thank you.
MP: 34:26 That wraps another episode of The Successful Bookkeeper podcast. To learn more about today's guests and to get access to all sorts of valuable free business-building resources, you can go to Thesuccessfulbookkeeper.com. Until next time,
MP: 34:40 goodbye
